Of Grace, Jennifer Knapp and gay Christians… an email dialog

This is a recent dialog via email between a friend and me. I think in some ways it expresses my feelings and where I am with the “gay Christian” debate. The point of this email exchange was not that I am right or he is right, but that it is taking place.

To iggy:

This quote shows such an ignorance of Scripture. What kind of effective ‘ministering’ could she have been doing all those years as a ‘Christian’ artist?

Knapp: The Bible has literally saved my life. I find myself between a Rock and a hard place-between the conservative evangelical who uses what most people refer to as the “clobber verses” to refer to this loving relationship as an abomination, while they’re eating shellfish and wearing clothes of five different fabrics, and various other Scriptures we could argue about. I’m not capable of getting into the theological argument as to whether or not we should or shouldn’t allow homosexuals within our church.

To Friend:

What kind of effective ministering do any of us do except what is done by and through the Holy Spirit? I had some of the most effective times dealing with some people while I was deep in doubt and using drugs and drinking…

Yet, not I that live; but Christ… and in the times I gave in to Jesus

And let Him do it, it was effective. Other times… it was just kindling. There is a lot of effective kindling out there in the church today… believe me.

To: iggy

Subject: Re:

However, she seems to show a real lack of understanding on some basics.

C’mon comparing homosexuality to SHELLFISH!

That’s why I’ve been gravitating towards Catholicism lately. They’ve got their priorities in order.

Although I understand your point.

To Friend:

Actually, many Christians use the verses in Leviticus to bash gay people…these same passages state we are not to eat shrimp, lobster, or wear clothes with mixed materials… in that case I am greatly in sin as I LOVE shrimp and lobster and most much I wear are mixed materials. The point is what of the Law carries over into our lives as New Creations?

There are better arguments on both sides… for me I take each person as an individual… as Paul states, “I do not even judge myself though my conscience is clear, for a clear conscience does not mean I am innocent.”(Slightly paraphrased)

To me, I see it as an area of identity, and we all have dark areas we struggle with… and some we do not. I let the Holy Spirit do His job in people… It is His job to convict of sin. So if someone at one point does not see his or her “sin” as sin the way I do, I let be. Of course it is harming others like murder of pedophilia I would do all I could for the safety of others, yet in prison, I would walk and talk about things with the person and let God work in them.

The bashing technique does not work. It only polarizes and hardens the other person… I am not fully convinced it is ok to be gay any more than I am convinced how most evangelicals deal with homosexuals is not also in a sinful manner. I fall somewhere in the middle where you feel the heat from all sides. Though by changing my approach I have found gay people more open to God and grace than ever… and were sin is, Grace abounds… where there is Grace, Jesus is at work… where Jesus is, Hope is there.

Just being the controversial thinker I am… = /

To: iggy

Subject: Re:

Yep…I’m not pointing the finger at anyone! It’s just the blatant disregard for obvious Scriptural truth that frustrates me. There are certainly gray areas but I don’t think this is one of them. 1Cor.5:11 Paul says but now I am writing you that you must not associate with anyone WHO CALLS HIMSELF A BROTHER but is sexually immoral or greedy…etc…with such a man do not even eat”.

Not that I wouldn’t have lunch with Jennie…but……….

To Friend:

I think the difference is context… in Corinth; the man openly bragged about sleeping with his father’s wife… and used grace as an excuse. Yet, in most cases of a gay relationship, it is not about abusing or flaunting grace but about attraction and love. Again, I am not sold on the gay is ok argument, yet, I do see that some of the arguments place verses as this is better context than the approved understanding.

Now, take homosexuality out of it… if a person is in a monogamous relationship for 8 years, though unmarried but still faithful to the other person, is that sexually immoral? If you read what the bible literally states in Genesis, Adam, and Eve were created for each other… but it does not say anywhere they were married. Also, in some cases as in two brothers who live together, if one of the brothers die, the other is commanded to take the brothers wife as his own, sleep with her to carry on the family. This is regardless to having a wife already… is that the sanctity of marriage the bible is ALL about? It was what God told Moses to tell His people to do… it was God approving polygamy. Is polygamy immoral? If I am a polygamist and I have multiply wives and I sleep with more than one at a time is that immoral… God’s word says it is not as what goes on in the marriage bed is pure…

By switching on one filter and reading the bible one way I can have God approved of only what I see as right. Jesus said that “God created them man and woman” and that is taken as what marriage is to be… One verse, yet many more verses state polygamy is fine and sanctioned by God.

Again, if a man is sleeping only with one woman and is committed to her are they married in the eyes of God or do they also need man’s testimony by means of a legal paper? What makes a marriage? Is it the legal paper that holds marriages together or determination of the to who claim to love each other? I am not arguing against marriage, so don’t take me wrong.

If a couple who is gay live in a monogamous relationship, and are moral citizens in all regards, are they immoral?

Now to add to all this what about woman being silent in church? It is also in Corinthians and is taught as being cultural… Yet, if we take it as we do the verse you gave we should not. What if both are cultural? What if the idea is that of the Roman rape that was done not out of sexual identity, but out of brutality? Roman Caesars were known to rape other men to show their power over them… as well as the Roman guards would do so to humiliate those they conquered; in fact this practice is still used today as I recall that the torture chambers of Saddam Hussein were spoken of doing this to both men and women.

The main argument is that in the passage you gave, Paul made up a word… there were words that meant exactly what we may take gay or homosexual to mean today, yet.

1) ANDROKOITHS, having intercourse with a man

2) ARRENOGAMEW, to marry men

3) ARRENOKOITHS, a sodomite (in the Attic form)

4) ARRENOMANHS, mad after males

5) ARRENOMIKTHS, a sodomite

6) ARSENOMIKTHS, also a sodomite

7) ARRENOMICIA, the word for sodomy itself

8) ARRENOPIPHS, one who looks lewdly on males.

Paul makes up a word out of two words…

In Greek, that reads (in transliterated form), “KAI HOS AN KOIMHQH META ARSENOS KOITHN GUNAIKOS, BDELUGMA EPOIHSAN AMFOTEROI; QANATOUSQWSAN, ENOIXOI EISIN.”

Paul takes two words and makes them one. “ARSENOS KOITHN” Its meaning is vague… but roughly means soft male or effeminate male… as in the case of male prostitutes… It is somewhat like the cultural reference some use to say woman should not speak in church… as woman priestesses/prostitutes were the ones that spoke with authority and Paul did not want these woman to gain power in Corinth… thus stated they should remain quite. If this word is more about the male prostitutes then it does not have much to do with the typical gay couple who love each other in a monogamous relationship.

As you can see I can argue both sides… I can sound convincing on both sides… but am I convinced either way? No. The point is that it is not all as cut-and-dry as it seems… and in a real sense I appreciate Jennifer Knapp’s honest answer… to me it is more honest than I have ever read before from someone in her position. There is no doubt she loves the Lord… and no doubt that she cannot deny who she is. The bottom line is the bible states that we should not judge things before the appointed time. Meaning in the end all will be judged by the words of Christ Jesus. Until then all of us who believe are given grace and faith to walk in the grace we receive. Some walk more boldly though appear to be more worldly… and some walk more timidly and with less faith though they appear in our eyes more holy and pure… God judges the heart and our inner being. As I stated already, even a clear conscience means nothing… we can so easily deceive our self.

To iggy:

Don’t get me wrong…homosexuality is just like any other sin as far as I’m concerned. What I have a problem with is the flagrant ‘in your face’ attitude.

To Friend:

My main problem is not about the “sin”… I know many heterosexual marriages that are just wrong and should have never been…

I see it a matter of grace. As far as grace I see no real limits, as far as a persons struggle in Grace, I believe if allowed, Love is the winner. As far as a person and their personal battle, I view them first as a believer and then deal with whatever their struggle is.

I have a friend who is a medical marijuana advocate. I am in agreement with him and see nothing wrong with what he does as far as that. Yet, he has another issue. He was a pothead before Jesus. He is a user and has found mental and physical reasons to keep using. It is deeper than that also. He is a user of people. His view of a friendship is what others add to his project. He wanted me to help validate his “ministry” to help those who need medical marijuana. When I was unable to get back to him for a while due to my surgery and other things, he began to leave messages that if I did not call him back I did not love him.

He has issues deeper than smoking pot. He has emotional/spiritual issues that go deep that he uses pot to mask. I go back and forth with the idea that God gave pot for people like him to bear with life or that my friend can only be turned over to the hands of God for Him to deal with, as I cannot.

I have friends who are gay. One left was gay all his life, got married, had children, yet left his wife for drugs, (gay) sex and rock and roll… after 20 years he and his wife got back together. I have known him for about 6 years now… he still sees himself as gay, yet because of his marriage vows sees he has made a sacrifice for his marriage. He loves his wife of course and even sends me articles stating that a gay person can have a fulfilling heterosexual marriage because of the love for the other. I have other friends who are openly lesbian and speaks of her “wife” lovely… and she is very much vocal about her faith in Jesus. She lived many years as a “straight” woman until she could not bear with the inner truth about her sexuality. In her mind, she is freer now in many ways than she was living in fear of being found out, and exposed. I know a couple in my church whose son is gay and left the church because he found no acceptance. They hurt so much and as I talk to them they see me as encouraging in that I accept gay people and see them like anyone else.

I realized a while back, I cannot change anyone, and if I did it would be worse for them as they would be in my image of who they should be. Instead now, I see that God has a handle on many things I did not see before. If God changes me in some way (or not) I must accept what I am given and live with it until God does something.

I know I am far from perfect… and yet God loves me…

Again, to me it is a case by case issue. I know there are some who are gay who believe it is a sin… so as I see it, it is to them. If that is the case then they need to follow the journey God has for them. If someone does not… regardless to whether I do or not, most likely I will not convince them any more than I can convince my pothead friend of his own deeper need. In the end, I can love them and accept them as Christ loves and accepts me. I can be there in their good times and in their bad times.

If I meet a man who gleefully speaks of rape and the Grace of God, I would not have fellowship with him. Yet, the majority of gay people I know, I would not hesitate to sit with them anymore than Jesus did with the sinners He ate with.

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Of Grace, Jennifer Knapp and gay Christians… an email dialog

This is a recent dialog via email between a friend and me. I think in some ways it expresses my feelings and where I am with the “gay Christian” debate. The point of this email exchange was not that I am right or he is right, but that it is taking place.

To iggy:

This quote shows such an ignorance of Scripture. What kind of effective ‘ministering’ could she have been doing all those years as a ‘Christian’ artist?

Knapp: The Bible has literally saved my life. I find myself between a Rock and a hard place-between the conservative evangelical who uses what most people refer to as the “clobber verses” to refer to this loving relationship as an abomination, while they’re eating shellfish and wearing clothes of five different fabrics, and various other Scriptures we could argue about. I’m not capable of getting into the theological argument as to whether or not we should or shouldn’t allow homosexuals within our church.

To Friend:

What kind of effective ministering do any of us do except what is done by and through the Holy Spirit? I had some of the most effective times dealing with some people while I was deep in doubt and using drugs and drinking…

Yet, not I that live; but Christ… and in the times I gave in to Jesus

And let Him do it, it was effective. Other times… it was just kindling. There is a lot of effective kindling out there in the church today… believe me.

To: iggy

Subject: Re:

However, she seems to show a real lack of understanding on some basics.

C’mon comparing homosexuality to SHELLFISH!

That’s why I’ve been gravitating towards Catholicism lately. They’ve got their priorities in order.

Although I understand your point.

To Friend:

Actually, many Christians use the verses in Leviticus to bash gay people…these same passages state we are not to eat shrimp, lobster, or wear clothes with mixed materials… in that case I am greatly in sin as I LOVE shrimp and lobster and most much I wear are mixed materials. The point is what of the Law carries over into our lives as New Creations?

There are better arguments on both sides… for me I take each person as an individual… as Paul states, “I do not even judge myself though my conscience is clear, for a clear conscience does not mean I am innocent.”(Slightly paraphrased)

To me, I see it as an area of identity, and we all have dark areas we struggle with… and some we do not. I let the Holy Spirit do His job in people… It is His job to convict of sin. So if someone at one point does not see his or her “sin” as sin the way I do, I let be. Of course it is harming others like murder of pedophilia I would do all I could for the safety of others, yet in prison, I would walk and talk about things with the person and let God work in them.

The bashing technique does not work. It only polarizes and hardens the other person… I am not fully convinced it is ok to be gay any more than I am convinced how most evangelicals deal with homosexuals is not also in a sinful manner. I fall somewhere in the middle where you feel the heat from all sides. Though by changing my approach I have found gay people more open to God and grace than ever… and were sin is, Grace abounds… where there is Grace, Jesus is at work… where Jesus is, Hope is there.

Just being the controversial thinker I am… = /

To: iggy

Subject: Re:

Yep…I’m not pointing the finger at anyone! It’s just the blatant disregard for obvious Scriptural truth that frustrates me. There are certainly gray areas but I don’t think this is one of them. 1Cor.5:11 Paul says but now I am writing you that you must not associate with anyone WHO CALLS HIMSELF A BROTHER but is sexually immoral or greedy…etc…with such a man do not even eat”.

Not that I wouldn’t have lunch with Jennie…but……….

To Friend:

I think the difference is context… in Corinth; the man openly bragged about sleeping with his father’s wife… and used grace as an excuse. Yet, in most cases of a gay relationship, it is not about abusing or flaunting grace but about attraction and love. Again, I am not sold on the gay is ok argument, yet, I do see that some of the arguments place verses as this is better context than the approved understanding.

Now, take homosexuality out of it… if a person is in a monogamous relationship for 8 years, though unmarried but still faithful to the other person, is that sexually immoral? If you read what the bible literally states in Genesis, Adam, and Eve were created for each other… but it does not say anywhere they were married. Also, in some cases as in two brothers who live together, if one of the brothers die, the other is commanded to take the brothers wife as his own, sleep with her to carry on the family. This is regardless to having a wife already… is that the sanctity of marriage the bible is ALL about? It was what God told Moses to tell His people to do… it was God approving polygamy. Is polygamy immoral? If I am a polygamist and I have multiply wives and I sleep with more than one at a time is that immoral… God’s word says it is not as what goes on in the marriage bed is pure…

By switching on one filter and reading the bible one way I can have God approved of only what I see as right. Jesus said that “God created them man and woman” and that is taken as what marriage is to be… One verse, yet many more verses state polygamy is fine and sanctioned by God.

Again, if a man is sleeping only with one woman and is committed to her are they married in the eyes of God or do they also need man’s testimony by means of a legal paper? What makes a marriage? Is it the legal paper that holds marriages together or determination of the to who claim to love each other? I am not arguing against marriage, so don’t take me wrong.

If a couple who is gay live in a monogamous relationship, and are moral citizens in all regards, are they immoral?

Now to add to all this what about woman being silent in church? It is also in Corinthians and is taught as being cultural… Yet, if we take it as we do the verse you gave we should not. What if both are cultural? What if the idea is that of the Roman rape that was done not out of sexual identity, but out of brutality? Roman Caesars were known to rape other men to show their power over them… as well as the Roman guards would do so to humiliate those they conquered; in fact this practice is still used today as I recall that the torture chambers of Saddam Hussein were spoken of doing this to both men and women.

The main argument is that in the passage you gave, Paul made up a word… there were words that meant exactly what we may take gay or homosexual to mean today, yet.

1) ANDROKOITHS, having intercourse with a man

2) ARRENOGAMEW, to marry men

3) ARRENOKOITHS, a sodomite (in the Attic form)

4) ARRENOMANHS, mad after males

5) ARRENOMIKTHS, a sodomite

6) ARSENOMIKTHS, also a sodomite

7) ARRENOMICIA, the word for sodomy itself

8) ARRENOPIPHS, one who looks lewdly on males.

Paul makes up a word out of two words…

In Greek, that reads (in transliterated form), “KAI HOS AN KOIMHQH META ARSENOS KOITHN GUNAIKOS, BDELUGMA EPOIHSAN AMFOTEROI; QANATOUSQWSAN, ENOIXOI EISIN.”

Paul takes two words and makes them one. “ARSENOS KOITHN” Its meaning is vague… but roughly means soft male or effeminate male… as in the case of male prostitutes… It is somewhat like the cultural reference some use to say woman should not speak in church… as woman priestesses/prostitutes were the ones that spoke with authority and Paul did not want these woman to gain power in Corinth… thus stated they should remain quite. If this word is more about the male prostitutes then it does not have much to do with the typical gay couple who love each other in a monogamous relationship.

As you can see I can argue both sides… I can sound convincing on both sides… but am I convinced either way? No. The point is that it is not all as cut-and-dry as it seems… and in a real sense I appreciate Jennifer Knapp’s honest answer… to me it is more honest than I have ever read before from someone in her position. There is no doubt she loves the Lord… and no doubt that she cannot deny who she is. The bottom line is the bible states that we should not judge things before the appointed time. Meaning in the end all will be judged by the words of Christ Jesus. Until then all of us who believe are given grace and faith to walk in the grace we receive. Some walk more boldly though appear to be more worldly… and some walk more timidly and with less faith though they appear in our eyes more holy and pure… God judges the heart and our inner being. As I stated already, even a clear conscience means nothing… we can so easily deceive our self.

To iggy:

Don’t get me wrong…homosexuality is just like any other sin as far as I’m concerned. What I have a problem with is the flagrant ‘in your face’ attitude.

To Friend:

My main problem is not about the “sin”… I know many heterosexual marriages that are just wrong and should have never been…

I see it a matter of grace. As far as grace I see no real limits, as far as a persons struggle in Grace, I believe if allowed, Love is the winner. As far as a person and their personal battle, I view them first as a believer and then deal with whatever their struggle is.

I have a friend who is a medical marijuana advocate. I am in agreement with him and see nothing wrong with what he does as far as that. Yet, he has another issue. He was a pothead before Jesus. He is a user and has found mental and physical reasons to keep using. It is deeper than that also. He is a user of people. His view of a friendship is what others add to his project. He wanted me to help validate his “ministry” to help those who need medical marijuana. When I was unable to get back to him for a while due to my surgery and other things, he began to leave messages that if I did not call him back I did not love him.

He has issues deeper than smoking pot. He has emotional/spiritual issues that go deep that he uses pot to mask. I go back and forth with the idea that God gave pot for people like him to bear with life or that my friend can only be turned over to the hands of God for Him to deal with, as I cannot.

I have friends who are gay. One left was gay all his life, got married, had children, yet left his wife for drugs, (gay) sex and rock and roll… after 20 years he and his wife got back together. I have known him for about 6 years now… he still sees himself as gay, yet because of his marriage vows sees he has made a sacrifice for his marriage. He loves his wife of course and even sends me articles stating that a gay person can have a fulfilling heterosexual marriage because of the love for the other. I have other friends who are openly lesbian and speaks of her “wife” lovely… and she is very much vocal about her faith in Jesus. She lived many years as a “straight” woman until she could not bear with the inner truth about her sexuality. In her mind, she is freer now in many ways than she was living in fear of being found out, and exposed. I know a couple in my church whose son is gay and left the church because he found no acceptance. They hurt so much and as I talk to them they see me as encouraging in that I accept gay people and see them like anyone else.

I realized a while back, I cannot change anyone, and if I did it would be worse for them as they would be in my image of who they should be. Instead now, I see that God has a handle on many things I did not see before. If God changes me in some way (or not) I must accept what I am given and live with it until God does something.

I know I am far from perfect… and yet God loves me…

Again, to me it is a case by case issue. I know there are some who are gay who believe it is a sin… so as I see it, it is to them. If that is the case then they need to follow the journey God has for them. If someone does not… regardless to whether I do or not, most likely I will not convince them any more than I can convince my pothead friend of his own deeper need. In the end, I can love them and accept them as Christ loves and accepts me. I can be there in their good times and in their bad times.

If I meet a man who gleefully speaks of rape and the Grace of God, I would not have fellowship with him. Yet, the majority of gay people I know, I would not hesitate to sit with them anymore than Jesus did with the sinners He ate with.

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Everything is amazing; nobody’s happy

a2a_linkname=document.title;a2a_linkurl=location.href;

Finally updated some links on this blog

I have been putting off updating my links and finally did it today! I did remove some that were dead and fixed a few that have moved again… and again… (if yours has moved and I missed it drop me a line!)

I did add more to my blog roll or to the list of “those who enable Iggy to write with such hatred about the Word of God and born again Christians“… errr as one of my lovely critics calls you… so on the top of my list of haters… I added:

2 Worlds Collide with Dr. James Galyon

adventures in mercy
Molly writes of recovering from culitish legalism and finding Jesus

Confession of a Recovering Pharisee

Kevin writes: I just finished a book called “Confessions of a Recovering Pharisee” that talks about my struggles and battles with legalism. I just need a publisher!”

Cwillz Spills (Interestingly the person who wrote about the enablers pointed out this great site!)

Emerging Worship

Shuan in the City

Subversive Influence

That is just a few I hoped to add… there will be more soon as I have time. Check them out and tell them iggy sent you!

var addthis_pub=”iggy”;

Finally updated some links on this blog

I have been putting off updating my links and finally did it today! I did remove some that were dead and fixed a few that have moved again… and again… (if yours has moved and I missed it drop me a line!)

I did add more to my blog roll or to the list of “those who enable Iggy to write with such hatred about the Word of God and born again Christians“… errr as one of my lovely critics calls you… so on the top of my list of haters… I added:

2 Worlds Collide with Dr. James Galyon

adventures in mercy
Molly writes of recovering from culitish legalism and finding Jesus

Confession of a Recovering Pharisee

Kevin writes: I just finished a book called “Confessions of a Recovering Pharisee” that talks about my struggles and battles with legalism. I just need a publisher!”

Cwillz Spills (Interestingly the person who wrote about the enablers pointed out this great site!)

Emerging Worship

Shuan in the City

Subversive Influence

That is just a few I hoped to add… there will be more soon as I have time. Check them out and tell them iggy sent you!

var addthis_pub=”iggy”;

Changes…

Some of you may already know I was laid off my job at the Billings Gazette. Apparently I was one of nine… with about 20 total with Lee Enterprises. I feel a bit relieved as the job was a real pain sometimes. Yet, I still need an income.

I am not destitute… yet… :wink:… I think we can make it a while.

This does make one look at things. Changes can be really scary. Not knowing where your paycheck will come from tomorrow has its own special joy. Over all I know God is in control.

Now, this may seem strange to some, but God let me know that “big changes” were coming. I already had some big changes at work and thought maybe those were the changes… yet, I was a bit surprised by the Big Change of being laid off. Again, God is in control and is my provider and has been faithful in the past many times.

Meanwhile, I am still in school and still at the Billings Vineyard Church. In fact this has opened opportunity to do more things of God. For instance, this Thursday I hope to meet with a couple of guy in Bozeman MT to talk to them about their starting an “emerging” ministry. I also hope that God will supply in a way that will allow me to pursue ministry full time.

I appreciate all of your prayers…

Be blessed,

iggy

Changes…

Some of you may already know I was laid off my job at the Billings Gazette. Apparently I was one of nine… with about 20 total with Lee Enterprises. I feel a bit relieved as the job was a real pain sometimes. Yet, I still need an income.

I am not destitute… yet… :wink:… I think we can make it a while.

This does make one look at things. Changes can be really scary. Not knowing where your paycheck will come from tomorrow has its own special joy. Over all I know God is in control.

Now, this may seem strange to some, but God let me know that “big changes” were coming. I already had some big changes at work and thought maybe those were the changes… yet, I was a bit surprised by the Big Change of being laid off. Again, God is in control and is my provider and has been faithful in the past many times.

Meanwhile, I am still in school and still at the Billings Vineyard Church. In fact this has opened opportunity to do more things of God. For instance, this Thursday I hope to meet with a couple of guy in Bozeman MT to talk to them about their starting an “emerging” ministry. I also hope that God will supply in a way that will allow me to pursue ministry full time.

I appreciate all of your prayers…

Be blessed,

iggy

Strange day in deed….

It was such a strange day today…

First off TES is sick as can be. I think it is a cold but I feel so lost without her by my side. I feel like I am missing a major organ.

I went swimming yesterday. I really do not like public pools. I was told I could not wear a t shirt while in the pool… I pointed I that it was strange I could not wear a t shirt but a kid could show 6 inches of butt crack… strange rules.

Then I noticed that my brand new LG Chocolate was in my short pocket… after I was in the pool. I tried to dry it out… so now it is a brand new dead LG Chocolate… I finally could afford it with the upgrades… but now most likely will have to go back to my old phone. I am bummed.

Today we had a family reunion. As my mom was heading out to get the food, her car would not start. She cannot get the key out of the ignition sometimes so it runs the battery down. I jumped started her car and she was on her way.

I then received an email from Ingrid Schlueter of Slice of Laodicea. She wanted to apologize to me and wondered why I “hated” her so much. I told her I do not “hate” her… never have never will. I disagree with her on many things…

She stated it was because of my “parody” blog… which I pointed out I am harder on the emerging church and “attack” my own friends! I also pointed out I am writing from an ODM viewpoint… I hold up the standard they have set on others and point out when they fail…

Now, it is strange when someone who calls 14 year old girls, “painted girls of Sodom” and states other sick and hateful things, thinks that me pointing out that this is wrong as hateful. I find it strange that some will judge and condemn Richard Abanes for an alleged lawsuit threat, yet they have done that very thing in the past and have closed down a site. I find it strange that I point out that Chris Rosebrough threatened to sue Richard Abanes… and I am hateful for saying it is all hypocrisy… I think the real issue is that I am holding their standard up to them… and they are seeing it for what it is and see it as hateful… well it is a mirror of sorts for them and that was my hope. I hoped they would see their own hate back at them… from one of their own who holds to their standard and calls them on it when they fail.

I find it strange that while some misuse Jesus to judge and condemn others, though Jesus did not come to condemn us, but to save us… that when I point out how wrong that is, I am hateful…

I do not hate any ODM… I pray for them that they have God’s best… and that they grow in the grace and knowledge of Jesus Christ. Though they constantly accuse me of not being a brother… I never call them less than my brothers and sisters in Christ.

Now I do appreciate her apology. And if I hurt her I am sorry, yet I suspect the hate whe sees is in me, comes from what she sees in herself… My prayers are with her.

OK, now back to the real world.

TES was too sick to go to the family reunion… so I gathered the kids and went… and as I drove there I felt like I could throw up… Sick to my stomach.

I helped get things set up and just felt worse and worse… I finally had enough and came home. I laid down for a bit hoping things would settle and fell asleep for 3 hours! I woke up and no one was home. TES had taken the kids for their “nap drive”. It seems they only nap when we drive… so TES took them for a drive and them stopped somewhere and slept a bit herself.

It was a strange day indeed.

Oh… and this is my second time I wrote this post… the first was lost when my “IE” crashed.

Be blessed,

iggy

Strange day in deed….

It was such a strange day today…

First off TES is sick as can be. I think it is a cold but I feel so lost without her by my side. I feel like I am missing a major organ.

I went swimming yesterday. I really do not like public pools. I was told I could not wear a t shirt while in the pool… I pointed I that it was strange I could not wear a t shirt but a kid could show 6 inches of butt crack… strange rules.

Then I noticed that my brand new LG Chocolate was in my short pocket… after I was in the pool. I tried to dry it out… so now it is a brand new dead LG Chocolate… I finally could afford it with the upgrades… but now most likely will have to go back to my old phone. I am bummed.

Today we had a family reunion. As my mom was heading out to get the food, her car would not start. She cannot get the key out of the ignition sometimes so it runs the battery down. I jumped started her car and she was on her way.

I then received an email from Ingrid Schlueter of Slice of Laodicea. She wanted to apologize to me and wondered why I “hated” her so much. I told her I do not “hate” her… never have never will. I disagree with her on many things…

She stated it was because of my “parody” blog… which I pointed out I am harder on the emerging church and “attack” my own friends! I also pointed out I am writing from an ODM viewpoint… I hold up the standard they have set on others and point out when they fail…

Now, it is strange when someone who calls 14 year old girls, “painted girls of Sodom” and states other sick and hateful things, thinks that me pointing out that this is wrong as hateful. I find it strange that some will judge and condemn Richard Abanes for an alleged lawsuit threat, yet they have done that very thing in the past and have closed down a site. I find it strange that I point out that Chris Rosebrough threatened to sue Richard Abanes… and I am hateful for saying it is all hypocrisy… I think the real issue is that I am holding their standard up to them… and they are seeing it for what it is and see it as hateful… well it is a mirror of sorts for them and that was my hope. I hoped they would see their own hate back at them… from one of their own who holds to their standard and calls them on it when they fail.

I find it strange that while some misuse Jesus to judge and condemn others, though Jesus did not come to condemn us, but to save us… that when I point out how wrong that is, I am hateful…

I do not hate any ODM… I pray for them that they have God’s best… and that they grow in the grace and knowledge of Jesus Christ. Though they constantly accuse me of not being a brother… I never call them less than my brothers and sisters in Christ.

Now I do appreciate her apology. And if I hurt her I am sorry, yet I suspect the hate whe sees is in me, comes from what she sees in herself… My prayers are with her.

OK, now back to the real world.

TES was too sick to go to the family reunion… so I gathered the kids and went… and as I drove there I felt like I could throw up… Sick to my stomach.

I helped get things set up and just felt worse and worse… I finally had enough and came home. I laid down for a bit hoping things would settle and fell asleep for 3 hours! I woke up and no one was home. TES had taken the kids for their “nap drive”. It seems they only nap when we drive… so TES took them for a drive and them stopped somewhere and slept a bit herself.

It was a strange day indeed.

Oh… and this is my second time I wrote this post… the first was lost when my “IE” crashed.

Be blessed,

iggy

The News is the Bomb!

I received a call about 11:30 Sunday stating that some had vandalized a news rack. I was a bit annoyed as I was up all night and was trying to get some sleep. I called the police who connected me to the officer on the scene.

“It looks like it was pried open and then set on fire.” The officer said.

I laughed.

He took more info from me like the value of the rack and then stated, “It looks as if it was a victim of a hate crime.”

I had to laugh again as that was about as funny thing I have heard in a long time.

Yet as it turns out, the business where the rack was, had been vandalized before.

Here are a couple of articles the first one is from a local T.V. station the second one from the Gazette where I work.

Now, when I arrived to pick it up, it looked to me like someone had placed a small explosive in it that blew out the bottom and the door the fell off. Inside you can see the burned papers.

It was funny yet also a bit unsettling to think someone would blow up a news rack because he or she hated the owner of the business because he is black. Billings had something like this happen a few years ago and the city stood up against it. I hope Billings will do that again.

Enjoy the pics though…

Blessings,
iggy